ACSOL’s Conference Calls

Conference Call Recordings Online
Dial-in number: 1-712-770-8055, Conference Code: 983459

Monthly Mtgs: June 15/16 Los Angeles (Conference), July 14 Phone [details]

2018 ACSOL Conference – Sign Up Now 

General News

Survey – International Travel after IML

If you have traveled to a foreign country after President Obama signed HR 515 / International Megan’s Law into law on February 8, 2016, please complete this survey to help gather details about the effects of this legislation. We will also share this data with the RTAG group for incorporation into their travel matrix. Thank you.

Go to International Travel Survey

Join the discussion

  1. TONY

    PK do you know if there are doing this to deregister sex offender?

  2. Chicago guy

    Here is a link to a list of countries that has all the relevant information…I believe they update it every so often but im not quite sure…so take a look if u are looking to travel..and maybe the sight here should put up a chart of their own

    http://restoringintegritytovirginiaregistry.blogspot.com/2016/06/what-countries-are-turning-away.html?m=1

  3. PK

    This most current Survey for International Travel after IML-
    It is worth posting the @TS’s research regarding how they are revoking Passports as we know it today:

    Three ways they are revoking passports:
    1) after return home through a Certified Letter,
    2) on the way traveling out of the country, or
    3) on return to country, and going through CBP secondary inspection

  4. PK

    Regarding the Passport Endorsement on the last page.
    I think the issue was discussed before, but I wanted to re-hash it to find out more thoughts about it.

    Does everyone think that the little statement on the last page of the Passport is that noticeable and would it be a real deterrence from entering into a Country?

    I’m not so sure, especially a Latin American Country who probably wouldn’t have any experience to look for this statement in the first place.

    • Need to Kno

      PK – I would tend to agree with this. I think the bigger issue is: 1) having it revoked and impacting travel, and 2) the notifications to the other countries. Those to me are the biggest obstacles.

      • JoshB

        @Need
        I can get around the Notification part.

        @Political
        “When there is an endorsement on the back page there is a note stating that at the bottom of the first page stating ‘see page 27′”

        Considering that the special endorsement for covered RSO’s is the first time something like that has been printed on page 27, I’m wondering how many Immigration Agents in the various countries actually pay attention to that?

        • AJ

          @JoshB:
          Considering that the special endorsement for covered RSO’s is the first time something like that has been printed on page 27, I’m wondering how many Immigration Agents in the various countries actually pay attention to that?
          —–
          Not true. I know someone who got re-married and instead of getting a new passport, got an endorsement stating the name change. I don’t know/recall if there was anything in the front saying, “see page 27,” but it would make sense. Otherwise, she would have to show it to the border agents herself to explain why the name isn’t what is “should” be.

          I also suspect the Foreign Affairs Manual State mentions (and provided?) in its Motion for Dismissal probably lists all sorts of Endorsements State has at its disposal.

    • Political Prisoner

      When there is an endorsement on the back page there is a note stating that at the bottom of the first page.

    • David Kennerly, The Government-Driven Life

      It depends. Some countries’ immigration officers, as you know, leaf through each and every page, scrutinizing everything. Others, such as the Dutch, seeing an American passport just open it to the first page and glance up to see if it’s the same face as the person standing before them. Regardless, I think the database, where our records dwell continuously and not just on a per-trip notification basis, is still a bigger deal than the passport. Who needs the big passport reveal when they can learn all about you on their screen as soon as they scan your passport? They get the dirt on you served-up on a silver platter. What could be worse? Which is why I’m very disappointed that our legal challenge is, at least for the time being, limited only to the passport.

  5. PS

    Seriously? If I have to trek through the jungle of Central and South America, I WILL get to where I want to be. I will remain silent about the actual country that I’m planning on retiring to. But come hell or high water, some POS statement on page 27 of the Passport is NOT going to stop me. I WILL NOT be a prisoner of the United States. This is utter BS for some POS misdemeanor.

  6. Cguy

    Has anyone tried to changed there name?

  7. David

    @ PK: I am thinking the same thing – I am hoping that the lawsuit will produce an injunction so DOS will be forced to stop revoking Registrants’ passports.

    • PK

      Let’s hope it comes sooner rather than later.

      If it doesn’t I would simply have to bite the bullet and face the consequences of returning. I will be alright for a while, but wouldn’t be able to stay away forever.

  8. TR

    Has the lawsuit against the IML been dismissed or is it still going on and still in stand?

    • David

      @ TR: There was an initial lawsuit filed against IML soon after it became law. Unfortunately, that first lawsuit was dismissed by the judge who believed the plaintiffs had “no standing” because they had not yet suffered any “injuries”. However, there is currently an active second lawsuit against IML and I believe the next court date for that lawsuit is June 25th in Los Angeles Federal Court.

    • E

      Hearing on the IML suit is scheduled for June 25. That’s after the ACSOL conference unfortunately. Would have been nice to know how that hearing goes before discussions at the conference about next steps.

      Wondering about a pro se suit since I got my revocation letter. I’d want to go beyond the identifier.

      • PK

        Hi E,
        I was wondering about the certified letter you received. Could you share as to whether or not this letter was adressed to you?

        In other words, sometimes anyone in the house can sign for a certified letter, even if the letter isn’t for them.

        I like in a shared house environment when I’m in the U.S. and I would hate for this letter to end up in the wrong hands.

      • PK

        Hi E,
        I was wondering about the certified letter you received. Could you share as to whether or not this letter the piece of paper you signed had your name on it.

        In other words, sometimes anyone in the house can sign for a certified letter, even if the letter isn’t for them.

        I live in a shared house environment when I’m in the U.S. and I would hate for this letter to end up in the wrong hands.

        • Lake County

          A certified letter and the form will always have your name on it, but usually anyone in the residence or on a PO Box can sign for it. They certainly wont address it to recipient. That is usually good enough for proof of delivery for government as it is also a federal crime for anyone else to open it. They can pay extra for the named recipient only to sign for it, but I doubt they would do that. Would anyone in your house normally open your mail? If not, I wouldn’t worry about it. And a return address from the U.S Passport Office shouldn’t suspicious to anyone.

        • E

          It was addressed to me by name. Return address was US State Department in official 9×12 brown envelope.

          Inside the letter was addressed to me by name with a business style name/address block at the top. But the DATE was STAMPED in the top
          right corner. It was NOT printed as part of the letter. Interesting?? Maybe they printed 850,000 of these letters (LOL) but hand stamp the date when they actually send it?? 🙂

          Btw my letter was identical to the one linked to at some point earlier this month on this blog.

        • PK

          @E

          So the actual small paper you signed DID NOT have your name on it correct?

          I’ve received Certified Letters in the past from the DMV that didn’t show any name.
          They kind of trick a person like that into signing something.

        • PK

          @E
          Perhaps it was the date that it was actually revoked.

          The actual letter had your name and address which would negate the possibility that these letter were pre-printed.

        • TS

          @PK

          A stamped date would make sense from an effective “in the system” revocation date after the printed letter with the name and address of the person has been worked through the system to revoke it electronically first before mailing. That process is common in all levels of government processing.

        • Lake County

          The notice you get for the registered mail will often not have the senders name on it, it often only has the senders zip code only on it. But I’ve never received a registered mail notice that did not have my name on it. Regardless, the piece of mail will have your name on it.

  9. robert

    If we have the new passports with the endorsement will we be able to go to the countries that dont have a ban on RSO’s? JUst wondering????

    • PK

      Who knows, it hasn’t been tested.

      The only way to really find out is to go spend a bunch of money for a plane ticket, then see if they let you in. Most probably will initially until they start to notice the endorsement.

    • JM of Wi.

      A friend of mine flew into Amsterdam with the “endorsement” with no issues.

      • PK

        @Jm

        I’m guessing that he also gave the 21 day advanced notice?

        • JM of Wi.

          Most definitely. He gave the 21 day notice 2.5 months in advance. Got paperwork from DOC stating they received it and forwarded to whoever they forward to.

  10. David

    If the lawsuit is successful in getting an injunction, I think the best answer to getting a brand new passport issued to you without the unique identifier is: Why not? It’s worth a shot. 👍🤞

  11. JM of Wi.

    Just a follow-up to my travel posts this month- returned from Netherlands early May, received my revocation of passport 5-21 ish approx 2 weeks later.
    I will wait a few months to reapply.

  12. Counting the days

    Update:

    My German passport will be issued as soon as my reduction is granted. Probably 3 months or so. My immigration attorney feels that submitting paperwork with felony creates unneeded scrutiny. Then I am gone. As a German citizen, she says I don’t have an obligation to inform ICE of my travels. I have to let California know of my residency change and that’s all. I can fly directly to Thailand and have family meet me @ airport. I will send a ” hello all” when free.

    • AJ

      @Counting the Days:
      As a German citizen, she says I don’t have an obligation to inform ICE of my travels.
      —–
      I hope she’s a sharp immigration attorney who understands dual citizenship. It would seem to me that until/unless you renounce your U.S. citizenship, you’re still required to comply with all U.S. federal laws (read: IML, SORNA…and paying taxes) imposed on its citizens, regardless what passport you carry. I absolutely have less knowledge on the matter than *any* attorney, but with RC crap, extreme caution is warranted.

  13. PK

    Im curious about one thing.

    Has anyone who has returned from international travel,,, NOT received a revocation letter from the State Dept?

    • Alec

      I’m curious about this too.

      So my situation is slightly unusual. I am not nor was I ever required to register on any registry in the United States, although i am a US Citizen. This is because I was never present in the US post-conviction (for something I didn’t do I might add, but that is another story). The Supreme Court has also already ruled that if you are outside the country, you are also not required to register. This means that clause 2 of the passport requirement does not apply in my case.

      However, this gives me no confidence that my passport won’t be revoked. I have managed to make a life for myself outside the US, and I would like to keep it that way. I really wish I knew if I could travel safely into the US, for example for business. I am tired of making excuses to my clients.

      • You are listed in Florida for LIFE!

        Since you have managed to escape the virtual prison of the USA DO NOT RETURN!

        If you return you will be allowed in as if you left yesterday however, once you get on a plane and try to enter another country (even the one you have lived in long term) they will probably send you back after receiving the GREEN NOTICE which will proceed your landing in the country of destination.

        Don’t risk it! I did and I am not stuck here in the U-S-A!

    • Janice Bellucci

      @PK – Very few people who travel overseas have had their passports revoked. It is the exception not the rule.

      • TONY

        @Janice Bellucci
        so what you are saying is that the exception is that only people that are consider cover sex offenders are getting passports revoked or I’m wrong found this

        §212b. Unique passport identifiers for covered sex offenders
        (a) In general
        Immediately after receiving a written determination from the Angel Watch Center that an individual is a covered sex offender, through the process developed for that purpose under section 21507 of title 34, the Secretary of State shall take appropriate action under subsection (b).

        (b) Authority to use unique passport identifiers
        (1) In general
        Except as provided under paragraph (2), the Secretary of State shall not issue a passport to a covered sex offender unless the passport contains a unique identifier, and may revoke a passport previously issued without such an identifier of a covered sex offender.

      • Major Henderson

        I received the revocation after being sent to the 3rd level of security when returning from Europe in April.

        • Need to Know

          @Major Henderson – what is the “3rd level of security?”

          All – would be great to find out if anyone in the forum has traveled international, given the 21 days, and has NOT received the revocation letter.

        • Major Henderson

          By 3rd level, I mean 1. The first place they check your passport, 2. Send you to secondary screening because your name is on the sex offender registry, 3. Send to have your luggage inspected. There the person asked if I knew why I was being selected for additional security. I told her that I knew it was because I was a registered sex offender. She said I could expect to always be selected for additional screening due to that fact. She entered some information into the computer and I assume that is when they forwarded it to Angel Watch.

        • AJ

          There the person asked if I knew why I was being selected for additional security.
          —–
          “Since I’m a free citizen, not carrying any contraband or undeclared goods, and who has completed any and all debts to society, no. Do you have a different perspective, Agent?”

        • TS

          Bravo, @AJ, Bravo

          Have to remember that one

      • CR

        Janice, how do you know this? Are statistics available for the number of travelers subject to IML who have returned from international travel without having their passports revoked versus those who have? Is there any knowledge or speculation about the criteria used by the State Department to decide which passports to revoke?

        • PK

          @CR

          There should be a Matrix for this also don’t you think?

          I’ve mentioned it before, but I really think Links to the RTAG Matrix and possibly a new Revocation Matrix should be prominently displayed in the Menu Section of this Website.

      • PK

        @Janice
        Thanks Janice. I’ll be able to roll with it in whatever happens, that’s IF AND WHEN I decide to return.

      • R M

        Janice, you say “Very few people who travel overseas have had their passports revoked. It is the exception not the rule.”

        Very few of what people? All people who travel overseas? All people committed of a sex offense?
        All people who committed a “covered” offense?

        Your statement is not well defined as I KNOW you are capable of doing Janice.

    • TS

      @PK, et al

      It could be hard to quantify those covered RCs who have traveled overseas that have had their passports revoked vs not, but not impossible using the questions @CR mentioned if someone was to do the research.

      IMO, I truly doubt Dept of State or anyone knows how many applicably covered RCs by USC are passport holders and have received reissued stamped passports VS those who are eligible for them only to be revoked VS those who are eligible, traveled, and got through the system w/o revocation. Not saying an algorithm could not be created to do the search and get some numbers, but who is going to do that without funding and a need to know?

      • PK

        @TS

        I don’t think they would need some special algorithm to determine whose passport has been revoked.

        My guess it’s probably less than 50. A simple database search based on selected filters regarding revocation for Sex Offenders who traveled, could easily be run to produce an actual number. Obviously the State Department wouldn’t disclose this.

        The people who have not had their passport revoked would be more difficult to determine.

        I was just wondering if anyone who participates in This Group has returned from international travel and has not received a revocation letter from the State Department.

        • Major Henderson

          I don’t think you will be able to get ANY information from the State Department. I called several times and got transferred to several different departments as I was attempting to find out how to apply for a new passport WITH the endorsement on it. Absolutely no one I spoke to even knew about the revocation, much less how to reapply. I was referred to Homeland Security and was told by them that they have nothing to do with passports. (obviously not true, as they are the ones that sex offenders are always sent to at the airport.) I’m guessing that there is a tightknit group of Angel Watch/State Department people that are working together to revoke our passports.

    • Warren

      Took a trip to Tahiti and been back for over an month and no revocation letter(Yet)! I travel 2-3 times a year International with family. I’m have a single 288(a) and live in CA so was expecting one this time. Did give the 21 day notice and had no problems in Tahiti and nearby Islands. We spent a month there. When we came back to Los Angeles, customs was a breeze, no secondary. Customs only had one question and asked it three times. Do you plan on taking a trip that long again? First told him maybe, then said don’t know and when he asked a third time I looked at my wife like what’s going on and she mouthed no to me and then I repeated that to customs officer and he said your free to go.

      I usually get pulled over for secondary so that was a surprise. I never had my bags or electronics searched in all trips international over the years. Plan on traveling to the Caribbean later this year and Europe next year. Safe travels.

      • Tuna

        has always bugged me when i read reports about them asking questions like this esp. since whatever answer you give has zero relevance to your admissability as a US Citizen which is all they should be concerning themselves with.

      • PK

        @Warren

        “I’m have a single 288(a) and live in CA so was expecting one this time.”
        Could you translate this for the rest of us who don’t live in California?

        You would be the only person that I know of:
        Who is- An RSO returned from an international trip, and DID NOT receive a passport revocation letter from the State Department.

      • James

        Dear Warren:

        Thanks a lot…it is good to know that Tahiti and I suppose related French islands are open to us….this also would tend to support the very vague report that Martinique in the Caribbean might also be a friendly stop.

        I am glad to see people still traveling…personally, I have put off/canceled and told people that I would not be there in S. France, N. Spain in June…and will also probably cancel Eastern Europe for August. There are always good reasons not to travel…busy and work and life and whatnot…so it is very good to see people out there doing things regardless of constraints…

        Kudos to you and thanks for the report.

        You are a good man, Sir.

        Best Wishes, James

  14. JoshB

    Passport Revocation- what does it mean really?

    When some RSO receives his Passport Revocation Letter in the mail from the State Department, what is the significance?

    My understanding is that the Revocation Letter indicates that the passport has been revoked.

    Does this mean, that if one were to try to use this passport in any of the 195 Countries in the entire world, that their system is automatically connected to the United States Passport System, which indicates that the passport is now revoked?
    Or do you think the passport could still be used to get into that country (barring any notification from CBP) ?

    Most certainly, upon any return to the United States they would grab that passport from your hand and it would never be seen again.

    • E

      While we don’t go through a physical passport control in the US when leaving the country, all passports ARE checked electronically through the airlines before departure. If you’re planning on flying to said country, the airline will Likely flag the passport as invalid. If you’re going by rubber dinghy you might be ok!!

      • PK

        I would choose the 2nd option. Looks like I won’t be able to use the 350K miles I’ve accumulated.

        • TS

          @PK

          I would gladly relieve you of those then if you are unable to use them. Can’t have them going to waste. 😉

  15. CR

    @Major Henderson, “Absolutely no one I spoke to even knew about the revocation, much less how to reapply.”

    ——-

    Sorry about this reply being out of line, but I am replying to the Major’s post above with the statement that I quoted.

    ——-

    All you should have to do is apply for a new passport. You’re already in the system and they know why they revoked your passport, so the State Department should send you a marked one without you needing to do or say anything special.

    If you aren’t planning international travel in the near future, you might consider holding off before applying for a new passport. If Janice or others win on an IML challenge, you may never have to suffer the ignominy of being issued and having to present to someone a scarlet letter passport.

    • Major Henderson

      That’s just it. They said that they did not see in the system that my passport had been revoked. Anyway, what I did was send a copy of the State Dept. letter with my new application.
      I do have a trip already booked for September, so I needed to get a valid passport.
      Re: challenge. If someone in California gets the court to say the new law is not valid, does that apply for all of the US states? Plus, I’m sure that if a lower court overruled the law, it would be appealed to a higher court.
      These people are out for blood.

      • CR

        “If someone in California gets the court to say the new law is not valid, does that apply for all of the US states?”

        I’m not a lawyer, but in general, and as I understand it, the answer to that question as it pertains to a lower court decision, whether state or federal, is no. It usually only applies to the parties in the case. It might be “as applied”, in which case it is has very narrow applicability. A class action applies to a class of people. Whether it is a civil or criminal case may make a difference, too.

        Often, lower court decisions on major questions of law are appealed by the losing side. An appeals court decision may have broader scope, at least in federal court. When it comes to contested federal constitutional issues, it may ultimately have to be settled by SCOTUS.

        The process can take years, sometimes decades.

        In the case of IML, challenges will be filed in a federal court, appealed to a US Circuit Court of Appeals, and then maybe taken up by SCOTUS.

        A denial of cert by SCOTUS does not set a precedent or speak to the merits of the case. Only when SCOTUS grants cert and renders an opinion will there be a ruling that affects everyone in the US.

        • David

          ACSOL’s current challenge to the IML passport law has been filed in the federal court system (not the California State system). Therefore, if ACSOL wins an injunction ordering the State Department to stop issuing those uniquely identified passports, then that injunctive relief would apply to passports throughout the U.S.

        • CR

          @David, that is not usually the case. Universal injunctions are the exception, not the rule.

  16. David

    Phone & Electronic Device Searches:

    If you are interested in the topic of Border Control Officers conducting searches on cell phones and electronic devices, you may wish to follow the two legal challenges of Kolsuz and of Alasaad. Please note that Courts are beginning to rule that some searches require “Individualized Suspicion”.

    “Courts Continue to Grapple with Border Searches of Electronic Devices: Fourth Circuit Rules Forensic Searches Require Individualized Suspicion” https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=63a09278-4f6f-42bf-a554-7779ea37387b

    https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/05/victory-alasaad-our-digital-privacy-border

    (Many of you may recall that it was not long ago that Janice won a case against California Department of Probation. The Court ruled that Probations could only use “blanket restrictions” against all sex offense probationers, they could only use “individualized restrictions”.)

  17. T

    Have we heard of anyone has traveled on the new passport? I’m wondering if anything has changed as far as being more heavily scrutinized or plain refused entry.

    I’ve had good luck going to Hong Kong but am afraid the new passport may create issues. I was also thinking of going to Malaysia next visit as Hong Kong can get pretty expensive.

Leave a Reply

We welcome a lively discussion with all view points - keeping in mind...  
  • Your submission will be reviewed by one of our volunteer moderators. Moderating decisions may be subjective.
  • Please keep the tone of your comment civil and courteous. This is a public forum.
  • Please stay on topic - both in terms of the organization in general and this post in particular.
  • Please refrain from general political statements in (dis)favor of one of the major parties or their representatives.
  • Please take personal conversations off this forum.
  • We cannot connect participants privately - feel free to leave your contact info here. You may want to create a new / free, readily available email address.
  • Please refrain from copying and pasting repetitive and lengthy amounts of text.
  • Please do not post in all Caps.
  • If you wish to link to a serious and relevant media article, legitimate advocacy group or other pertinent web site / document, please provide the full link. No abbreviated / obfuscated links.
  • We suggest to compose lengthy comments in a desktop text editor and copy and paste them into the comment form
  • We will not publish any posts containing any names not mentioned in the original article.
  • Please choose a user name that does not contain links to other web sites
  • Please send any input regarding moderation to moderator [at] all4consolaws [dot] org
ACSOL, including but not limited to its board members and agents, does not provide legal advice on this website.  In addition, ACSOL warns that those who provide comments on this website may or may not be legal professionals on whose advice one can reasonably rely.  
 

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Please answer this question to prove that you are not a robot *