ACSOL’s Conference Calls

Conference Call Recordings Online
Dial-in number: 1-712-770-8055, Conference Code: 983459

Monthly Meetings
Q4: [details]

Other Events
ACSOL Conference: June 15/16, 2018 in Los Angeles [details]

General News

General Comments December 2017

Comments that are not specific to a certain post should go here, for the month of December 2017. Contributions should relate to the cause and goals of this organization and please, keep it courteous and civil.

Join the discussion

  1. mike r

    I am going to call the clerk when they open and the AG to see if they will agree to my extension and I do not even care if they say “oh don’t worry bout you have such and such time” I am filing unless I see a statue or code or rule in writing with a definitive answer. I would rather look stupid then lose my case for some lame tech. like that.

  2. mike r

    Matter of fact I am requesting the maximum amount of time according to the rules..

    The Plaintiff respectfully requests this Court enter an order extending the deadline for responding to the Attorney General’s Motion to Dismiss Complaint and/or Claims Six through Nine of the Complaint to the allowable 28 days pursuant to Local Rule 144 (Fed. R. Civ. P. 6) (a). The Plaintiff requests the Court to set the deadline for filing a response to January 8, 2017.

  3. mike r

    Well, just talked to the AG and she agreed to the new date and stated she would not object to it. Talked to court clerk and they are unsure so I am filing.

  4. It doesn't get better

    This story just goes the hypocrisy of the collective American conscience:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/11/us/bullying-video-keaton-jones.html

    A great deal of celebrities, public figures and athletes are rallying behind this bullied kid on social media using his plight as a platform for free PR, offering to fly him out for movie events, gifts and selfies. Yet, here WE ARE twisting in the wind, languishing in perpetuity with our PICTURE and personal, private info posted Online for the whole world to see.

    If that’s not the highest form of bullying then I don’t know what is!!

    Further, we’re forced to live a LIE because the unsuspecting public is being duped and bamboozled into believing we’re a credible safety threat.

  5. Gralphr

    One thing I’ve noticed over the years is many of those in government going out of their way to pass these crazy sex offender laws, are committing illegal acts themselves and only doing it for cover. I really feel these guys once convicted should receive thousands of letters for registrants calling them out for making our lives hell.

    • steve

      That’s a great idea. We should ALL send Anthony Weiner a letter, very short, explain how the laws he helped create and passed are affecting our lives and soon he will see how bad life is once you’re out and then wish him luck. I’m sending mine off this week.

      ANTHONY WEINER
      Register Number: 79112-054
      FMC DEVENS
      FEDERAL MEDICAL CENTER
      P.O. BOX 879
      AYER, MA 01432

      • C

        I’m pretty sure he’s well aware, but apart from rubbing his nose in the mess, like a yet-to-be-housebroken puppy, what good will that do?

        I’m as happy as the next RC when a politician crashes and burns, but Anthony Weiner, in my view, strikes me as the kind of guy who reacts to crisis by thriving, not cowering and hiding.
        Sure, send him letters and make him, a man who knows, how to get things done, an ally.

  6. Chris F (@Mike R)

    I’m coming up empty Mike R.

    I don’t know why they make it so hard to find the rules. Lawyers really want to keep all this to themselves and keep the fight out of our hands. I don’t know how to find the rules for a federal file in your district.

    As for all those that aren’t helping, it’s a shame but kind of the way our system is designed. Think of how much we had to learn just to know the basics of the Constitution and how our legal system works. It’s really so beyond the common folk that just getting started in it is the equivalent to getting a masters degree. Just look at how many people went through the process of becoming a lawyer and still don’t understand this stuff and end up setting bad precedents with poor representation and no understanding of the early 2002-2003 SCOTUS cases as well as don’t understand what Substantive Due Process is. Heck, most judges don’t know.

  7. Mike W

    So, we won Doe v. Snyder for those in the 6th Circuit. What do we do next? I’d kinda like to get a tap on the shoulder and a “never mind. You don’t need to register anymore” But I doubt that is going to happen. My offense was decades ago, pre the 2006 & 2011 law (’88). Is the Michigan State Police going through the ones that need to released? Do we have to wait on new laws (that may never come) to go on the books? Please, someone spin the wheel, I’d like to buy a clue!

  8. kind of living

    msn News…….. Hitller -themed homework upsets parents of Illinois middle school students . ,,,,, ,, I mean Really ? some where on down the line I see how this could be used to shape our children’s minds , by changing history to fit the true agenda , lol , I mean , who said it was ok to do this at this school ? and how could something like this affect RC’s, and there children in a very real would yet to come ?

  9. mike r

    Yeah, I hear you Chris. I guess I can’t expect people to want to learn about what’s causing them and the damn country such great harm. It’s a shame and your right I really believe that 80% of the attorneys out there are either just ignorant, have mental deficiencies, or are just crooks stealing peoples money. It’s the nature of the beast I guess. I’m not just talking out my a^^& when I say i’m so glad I found you and a few other people that knows what’s up, are intelligent, knowledgeable, and are willing to spend the time to make something happen. I am really shocked at the lack of involvement by any group or organization. I know I shouldn’t be but come on man, this is insane man. I started to this crap in a lot of ways just to help others (until the tiered bill system passed) now it isn’t about them as much anymore, it’s more about me and the country. and the few others that have helped. See if you can notice something wrong with my motion for extension. it is really obvious and can potentially be bad but I don’t think so. I will have to call the clerk and ask them but I think it is just a minor technical error and it’s is obvious what I was stating. Oh by the way I made to the court house with like twelve minutes to spare.

    AJ, caught your post and you got 14 before I found one instance it’s 21 before another that showed two weeks after the filing date. Thedamn clerk doesn’t even know, it doesn’t matter now since I filed.

  10. David Kennerly, "In the long list of all of your problems, I'm the least of them"

    “Sex Registries as Modern-Day Witch Pyres: Why Criminal Justice Reform Advocates Need to Address the Treatment of People on the Sex Offender Registry”
    https://injusticetoday.com/sex-registries-as-modern-day-witch-pyres-why-criminal-justice-reform-advocates-need-to-address-the-aca3aaa47f03

  11. mike r

    No guessing, I put Jan 8 “2017” instead of 2018. Clerk wouldn’t say I should or should not amend. I am still considering whether I need to or not since I explicitly requested a 28 day extension so I don’t know what I am going to do yet. I might just leave it. I hate that when I rush I miss something like that.

  12. TXSO4Life

    A new decision (State of Washington vs Jayson Lee Boyd) coming out of Washington State COP today upholding “weekly” in-person requirement for homeless register citizen. In a 2-1 decision, the panel rules the reporting requirements (52 times a year) in addition to a detail logs of streets, corners, and where he sleep each days of weeks that he must keep record, is not punishment and does not violated ex pos facto clause. See the link
    https://www.courts.wa.gov/opinions/pdf/749331.pdf

  13. AJ (@mike r)

    I don’t know about many of you, but in some ways I’m glad to see the current witch-hunting of “inappropriate sexual conduct.” At minimum, I feel it waters down things a bit for us, as some will see the only difference between whatever public figure and me is that (a) I got caught, or (b) couldn’t afford the lawyer the public figure could. I’m not saying we’re magically welcomed back into the tribe or anything, but the pervasiveness of it all can only help us in some way, eventually. Maybe I’m merely being hopeful.

    • AJ

      oops…sorry for the (@mike r) tags remaining in my handle. The comment was for everyone.

    • Tim Moore

      Agree Mr. AJ. It not only waters down the panic by putting familiar faces on despised crimes, but as people see their beloved senator or screen actor lose his career and suffer public humiliation, people will start to question methods and priorities.

    • C

      I am not sure what to make of all this – does it water it down or fuel the fire, turning up the heat on all of us? We are seeing these high profile celebs and politicians getting ‘convicted by headline,’ as someone else put it, and as I watch the news in the morning I wonder if the male talking head will be there tomorrow?
      I am happy to see politicians who supported the registries get burned by their own antics even, w/ out due process. 2017 will be my year of schadenfreude.

      Whatever the case, good or bad, I have absolutely zero sympathy for Franken, Moore, Lauer, et al., particularly on this day when I just spent the morning making sure my kids were dressed in the best attire to perform in today’s school Christmas show which, of course, I will miss again this year because “I was too busy at work.

  14. AJ

    The Pepitone case in IL is creeping along. He filed his brief in mid November (https://narsol.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/No.-122034-People-v.-Pepitone-Appellee-Brief.pdf), and they make some good arguments. I fear the IL SC will follow SCOTUS’s statement that a law being overinclusive or underinclusive does not make it unconstitutional.

    @mike r: I recommend your reading the brief for the quotes and data used at the beginning, especially in chopping away at “frightening and high.”

  15. Sam

    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1824110147620467&id=908009612563863
    Not sure who all can see this but here is why people say they’re still supporting Moore. Most just don’t seem to care or believe.
    Funny how these people are so accepting of him but people on the registry they want to lunch.

  16. mike r

    Agreed AJ. like i stated in my other post all the politicians and Hollywood elites and media giants like bill oriely are enjoying the the fruits of their labor and KARMA . Man can you believe that crap about the guy having to register every week and keep a detailed description of everywhere he goes or sleeps. Man there would be hell to pay an a whole lot of innocent people wouldn’t be to happy I can tell you that.Thats all I’ll say about that. Insane.

    • New Person

      @Mike R…

      this isn’t on the same thread logic conversation with you and AJ, but I just wanted to leave a message for you and replying under your message seems the most efficient way.

      The whole “involuntary servitude” idea continues to evolve in my head.

      Here’s what the DA listed for accepted involuntary servitude:
      1. Jury Duty
      2. Military Service
      3. Road Work
      4. Tax reporting

      Now, let’s separate the list into two groups based upon birth of service.
      I. Birth to all (CA) citizens:
      … 1. Jury Duty
      … 2. Military Service
      … 4. Tax Reporting

      II. Birth stemming from a conviction:
      … 3. Road Work

      =====

      We all know the registry was birth from a conviction. Yet the registry is not punishment. Road work, presuming it’s part of the service when you’re under custody, is constitutional because it is the only exception to involuntary servitude. Being under custody is part of your punishment, which also includes restrictions. Those restrictions can be found if you are granted probation or parole. While not in a physical edifice blatantly informing you and all others that you are under custody (in service of the state) when you are on probation or parole, you still are under custody for the duration of the term of probation or parole and must abide by all services required of you, such as in-person reporting, abiding by restrictions, and informing the state of your whereabouts pertaining to travelling.

      Under custody, you are compelled to abide by whatever the stated levies upon you to comply with or be punished (or punished further). The registry is no different. You are still under custody of the state. You are still subjected to in-person reporting or be punished. You are subjected to following restrictions set by the state only to registrants or be punished. You are subjected to informing the state of your whereabouts on travelling or be punished.

      Well, that’s odd. Only registrants are subjected to custodial services to the state after serving their punishment to the state. This is why Justice Kennedy’s opinion in Peckingham vs NC had a parenthetical querying why is this group still subjected to such restrictions beyond their custody?

      Is there a difference between registrant convicts and non-registrant convicts? Why is there a separate implementation upon registrants? According to both the US and California constitution, involuntary servitude is prohibited unless to punish a crime. Megan’s List states it is “your duty” to register and failure to register is a felonious crime.

      According to CASOMB, the recidivism rates of registrants for the past couple of years have been below 1%. There are several other convict groups whose recidivism rates record much higher than registrants. Yet only registrants are subjected to custodial services to the state after serving their punishment.

      Why is there a separate implementation on registrants. We already know about the registration and compelled services it entails, but what about immunity programs, specifically 1203.4. Registrants are not allowed to partake in full immunity under this program. No where in 1203.4 does it state registrants are not allowed full immunities, but in a different statute, it states registrants are not allowed full immunity. So not only are registrants forced to still serve the state of California like no other sets of convicts, registrants are also treated differently when it comes to conviction immunities. That is only for 1203.4. There is no petition for 1203.4. You are granted it after successfully completing all requirements. There is no second judgement on your conviction here.

      Then, registrants must wait a total of 10 years in California to petition for a Certificate of Rehabilitation, with the requirement of 5 consecutive years of residency in California before petitioning. This a subtle 10-year extension of captivity where your cell is all of California. If you wish to be off the registry, you must “serve” 10 years minimum in California. This limits your exercise of free travel as you cannot move out of state for families or potential jobs. But this also limits what type of job opportunity and housing help availability because you are on the registry (California has only one type of registrant – lifetime). The petitioning aspect implies a second judgement upon your conviction. Is the state going to extend your service? And based upon what set standard? Is that standard equal to all citizens? Wait… why is there a second judgement? This second judgement is another factor depicting that the registry was born out of conviction and not born to all Ca citizens.

      Even then, some registrants must need to apply for a Governor’s Pardon to be off the registry.

      Finally, there are some who do not get off the registry at all.

      All these steps to try to remove oneself from the registry reveal the same consistent idea – the registry was born out of conviction, the registry is not born to all citizens. The immunity process requires a second or third judgement based upon the same conviction.

      No other sets of convicts are subjected to these custodial services to the state after completing their punishment custody nor have specific rules. All convicts should be subjected to the registry or no convicts are subject to the registry, which is an equal protection issue. Statute 1203.4 actually tests the equal protections issue as 1203.4 specifically states the only exceptions are to be written within 1203.4. Any who qualify and fit the 1203.4 immunity program should receive full benefits permitted, relieving all penalties and disabilities from the conviction. Notice, it does not designate between punitive nor regulatory, but rather the complete inclusiveness of the word description “all”.

      The registry is not punishment, according to the 2003 Smith v Doe decision. The registry was born due to a crime. In order to remove oneself from the continued custodial act of the registry, one has to petition off the registry from that crime, which is a second judgement based upon that same crime. Megan’s List states it is your duty to register, which is a service, and failure to do said service is punishable under law. No other sets of convicts are subjected to the same extended penalties or a whole class excluded from full immunities granted by immunity program 1203.4.

      So although we know the births of involuntary servitude have been clearly defined between jury duty, military service, road work, tax reporting, and the registry, let’s recall the four classical factors of involuntary servitude:

      1. Contract
      2. Term
      3. Compensation
      4. Domineer

      =====
      1. Contract. This is proof that the registry was birth from a conviction because the contract was initiated from a conviction due to a crime. The problem here is that the registry is not classified as punishment!

      ::: This first classical factor is really important now to involuntary servitude as we now know the registry was born out of a conviction, and not born to all citizens such as jury duty, military service, or tax reporting! Thank you DA for pointing out the differences in involuntary servitude! :::

      2. Term. In California, the term of the registry is lifetime.

      Since jury duty, military service, and tax reporting have no contract born out of a conviction, then it is not subjected to factor 2: Term.

      There is no variance to the risk level of registrant. All registrants are subject to a lifetime term. But a lifetime term is a red flag for any job.

      Remember, the registry is not punishment. Because the registry is not punishment, it must be categorized differently. Therefore, it is a contractual service placed upon a free person.

      3. Compensation. There is no compensation.
      You are paid for in-person reporting to jury duty and military service. You are paid to follow their rules and regulations (which includes restrictions). Tax reporting requires no in-person reporting, but you can also pay a third party to do your work. But remember, jury duty, military service, and tax reporting are all born to all citizens. There was no contract initiated like there is for registering because the contract was initiated from a conviction. So the point is moot to even include jury duty, military service, and tax reporting after classical factor 1.

      Now, let us compare registrants to non-registrant convicts, where there is a contract from a conviction. If you finish your custodial punishment to the state, then you no longer have to report to the state or service the state. There is no compensation for your service to the state because that is your punishment. There is no registry for robbers, drug users, drug sellers, DUI’s, etc…

      But a registrant goes through punishment custody duty and has the registry custody duty to the state of California after or concurrent to punishment custody duty. The registry is not punishment. If it is not punishment, then where is the compensation? The services under custody for punishment is similar to services for the registry and both are not compensated, but only one of them is categorized as punishment.

      Immunity reward for convictions that qualify for 1203.4.
      If a convict who qualifies for the 1203.4 immunity program, then that convict receives full immunities. A registrant who qualifies for the 1203.4 immunity program does not receive full benefits as stated within 1203.4 and 1203.4 states the only exceptions are written with 1203.4, which does not state anything pertaining to exclude registrants who qualify from not receiving full benefits.

      This lack of immunity compensation also compounds the lack of compensation due to the registry.

      4. Domineered. You can walk away from a service where the only consequence is loss of pay or a loss of job. Anything greater than that is domineering an individual to do continued service(s).

      Again, the premise is there was a contract struck. The registry was a contract initiated from a conviction. (Jury duty, military service, and tax reporting are not born out of conviction, they are born to all citizens.) That contract is not punishment. Thus, it is a contract upon a free person (someone no longer under custody). A free person has the capability to walk away from a service without any penalty higher than the loss of wage or loss of occupation. The signs of domineering is when an individual leaves the service, but is hunted down, possibly punished, and returned to service. This is exactly what the registry does to a free person (an individual no longer under custody).

      I reiterate, the registry is not punishment. The registry was born out of a conviction.

      Involuntary servitude is prohibited unless to punish a crime.

      ****
      Amendment XIII

      Section 1.

      Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
      ****

      There is only one exception to involuntary servitude and that is to punish a crime. That means involuntary servitude is allowed if it was born out of conviction. The registry was born out of conviction, but it is constitutionally classified as “not a punishment”. We need to compare apples-to-apples with the registry as it pertains to the 13th amendment. The registry was born from a conviction and is not punishment. By law, the registry “shall not exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.”

      Please note, the 13th amendment does not state the different levels of severity of slavery or involuntary servitude. This means any type of slavery or involuntary servitude is unconstitutional, with one exception – to punish a crime. The registry was born from a crime and the SCOTUS said it is not punishment. If it is not punishment, then it is unconstitutional. I cannot walk away from the registry without being hunted down, possibly punished, and then returned to service as the registry is aided by the law of the land, the fourth classical factor of involuntary servitude: domineered.

  17. Worth a Look

    Hi everyone,

    I ran across this article on Medium called, “Sex Registries as Modern-Day Witch Pyres: Why Criminal Justice Reform Advocates Need to Address the Treatment of People on the Sex Offender Registry.”

    No new info here, but a very positive take on the registry, and the truth about the registry in our society.

    https://injusticetoday.com/sex-registries-as-modern-day-witch-pyres-why-criminal-justice-reform-advocates-need-to-address-the-aca3aaa47f03

  18. matthew

    Has anyone brought up the issues the registry brings on possible identity theft? A simple criminal can use information from either megan’s law or 3rd party websites to look up any person’s full name, address, identifying marks, etc It may be a longshot but it can be one more reason.

  19. mike r

    Man this sure seems like a no brainier with this report, how much better could it get? I know I used part of this and cited it I never read it. This is incredible .

  20. mike r

    Ah they wouldn’t let me post it or something, probably because it isn’t published maybe. https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/225370.pdf try this. Man you guys might have already saw this but I never really read it until now…..Must read if you haven’t…………….

Leave a Reply

We welcome a lively discussion with all view points - keeping in mind...  
  • Your submission will be reviewed by one of our volunteer moderators. Moderating decisions may be subjective.
  • Please keep the tone of your comment civil and courteous. This is a public forum.
  • Please stay on topic - both in terms of the organization in general and this post in particular.
  • Please take personal conversations off this forum.
  • We cannot connect participants privately - feel free to leave your contact info here. You may want to create a new / free, readily available email address.
  • Please refrain from copying and pasting repetitive and lengthy amounts of text.
  • Please do not post in all Caps.
  • If you wish to link to a serious and relevant media article, legitimate advocacy group or other pertinent web site / document, please provide the full link. No abbreviated / obfuscated links.
  • We suggest to compose lengthy comments in a desktop text editor and copy and paste them into the comment form
  • We will not publish any posts containing any names not mentioned in the original article.
  • Please choose a user name that does not contain links to other web sites
  • Please send any input regarding moderation to moderator [at] all4consolaws [dot] org
ACSOL, including but not limited to its board members and agents, does not provide legal advice on this website.  In addition, ACSOL warns that those who provide comments on this website may or may not be legal professionals on whose advice one can reasonably rely.  
 

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Please answer this question to prove that you are not a robot *