ACSOL’s Conference Calls

Conference Call Recordings Online
Dial-in number: 1-712-770-8055, Conference Code: 983459

Monthly Meetings | Recordings (3/20 Recording Uploaded)
Emotional Support Group Meetings


MI: AG Dana Nessel Does The Unthinkable – Argues The Truth About SORA (Commentary)

Michigan’s Attorney General has entered the cultural and legal conflagration of how we reckon with sexual violence in our society with a remarkable (and compelling) argument: Michigan’s sex offender registries are not effective at stopping sexual violence.

It’s a remarkable argument. Safety and accountability have been the ostensible watchwords in our ongoing collective discussion of sexual violence, but strong (and understandable) emotion has tended to override those concerns and diverted discourse into negative-feedback loops of ever more brutal consequences for anyone who would even be perceived to stand in the way of that punitive impulse. Just ask Aaron Perksy. Full Commentary

Guy Hamilton-Smith is a Board Member of ACSOL and a scheduled speaker at the 2019 ACSOL Conference.

We welcome a lively discussion with all view points - keeping in mind...  
  • Your submission will be reviewed by one of our volunteer moderators. Moderating decisions may be subjective.
  • Please keep the tone of your comment civil and courteous. This is a public forum.
  • Please stay on topic - both in terms of the organization in general and this post in particular.
  • Please refrain from general political statements in (dis)favor of one of the major parties or their representatives.
  • Please take personal conversations off this forum.
  • We will not publish any comments advocating for violent or any illegal action.
  • We cannot connect participants privately - feel free to leave your contact info here. You may want to create a new / free, readily available email address.
  • Please refrain from copying and pasting repetitive and lengthy amounts of text.
  • Please do not post in all Caps.
  • If you wish to link to a serious and relevant media article, legitimate advocacy group or other pertinent web site / document, please provide the full link. No abbreviated / obfuscated links.
  • We suggest to compose lengthy comments in a desktop text editor and copy and paste them into the comment form
  • We will not publish any posts containing any names not mentioned in the original article.
  • Please choose a user name that does not contain links to other web sites
  • Please send any input regarding moderation or other website issues to moderator [at] all4consolaws [dot] org
ACSOL, including but not limited to its board members and agents, does not provide legal advice on this website.  In addition, ACSOL warns that those who provide comments on this website may or may not be legal professionals on whose advice one can reasonably rely.  
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments

Soul murder…. Destroying a persons identity and personality is a very cruel punishment.

I found being released back into society, was a “second prison” because of the horrendous restrictions that would never end and the restrictions goals would simply destabilize me from leading a productive life to my fullest. That isn’t rehabilitation but rather obstacles and traps.

Michigan’s registry is so broken it’s chief law enforcement officer is begging for it to stop.

Hope we can get somewhat of a life back, thank You!

I feel that sending her supportive letters & emails will help her ( and by extension ) our cause. She is going to receive a lot of flack for her opinion, so let’s show her support. Her email is easy to find, so get on it!

I agree. More importantly, vote for these people. I feel like most people probably don’t pay enough attention to their voting. I use the Registries as pretty much the only criteria for voting. One reason is because if a person supports the Registries, you can be CERTAIN there is something really, really wrong with them. They may be hiding it very well. But if they support the Registries, they don’t belong in Amerika, let alone in any position with influence. Let them go write laws in China or some other place they’ll fit in better. We don’t need their kind… Read more »

There’s no such registry law in China. My home country had never, and will not ever punish people like what your government is doing on all of you group people, especially their own citizens. I wish people will ge educated and learned recognized true from faul, you people have long brainwashed by your big government, I guess you have seen it.

I’m ignorant of the laws of other countries for sure. And I certainly do believe that the criminal regimes in Amerika, especially the federal criminal regime (with our obviously pathological lying president), would lie and run propaganda campaigns about other countries. I’ve certainly formed an impression that China would love Registries. But I don’t know anything about it. Do they allow free speech? Do they imprison people for life for using drugs? I don’t know but I do know that people, in general, suck. They’ve been attacking each other for thousands of years and I don’t see that stopping. Registries… Read more »

Hello everyone,

He is the schedule for March oral arguments concerning Michigan v David Snyder and Michigan v Paul Betts

Hi Everyone here is yesterdays conference call recording

Hello Bobby, I just listen to the conference call, I did speak on it, but wanted to listen to it again, thanks for the link. Also I thank some of the attorney’s may starts seeing $$$ signs and find the way to sue for money damage, I think anyone could be held liable in there individual capacity, and the boogieman rules, as the parole board used for years etc… If you can please post the lik of the video of the up coming court case, thank You!

@Bill, So you were the Bill i heard on the broadcast. I think they answered some questions but not all of them. I still can’t figure out how the prosecutors are suppose to argue for the registry when their boss Ms. Nessel is arguing against it in our favor no less. I. have to go check in, in March so it’s going to be interesting how my local food will react and respond to this news. Also i will post the oral arguments as soon as they are available is that what you are talking about, Michigan v David Snyder… Read more »

Like you, I have my first check in coming up in March too…I usually try to get it over & done as quickly as possible….I think this time that I’m going to wait until after the hearings before I bother to go in and pay $50 for the humiliation of verifying my info…As for asking questions of your local LE it sounds to me like a waste of time & breath…the peons will have no idea what’s going on….

Yes that was me, and your right that’s the cases March the 6th I would like to see, Seems like they can’t argue against them self,hopefully this stops the Madness!!! Thanks for all your Help!

@everyone, Here is another article that was posted on 2-28-19. in case anyone is interested in reading it.

@Bobbie….. article? where?


Thanks for posting that article link here. I encourage others to read it also if they have the time and inclination. It is really good! It was picked up by the national SOL office too.

The best quote here: “We don’t think the registry is useful at all,” Aukerman told Daily Kos.

@ Bill So you were the Bill on the call, glad you asked that question even though they really didn’t have an answer for it. I also don’t think they kept a whole lot of focus on the subject matter in my opinion. I still don’t understand how the prosecutors can argue for the registry when their boss Ms. Nessel writes to briefs and argues against the registry and admits it’s punitive and unconstitutional, it just seems like a conflict of interest to me. I just wish they would of spoke more on the up coming cases on March 6th… Read more »

Seems like they should have talk a lot more about up coming court date March 6th, and the other guy that called in from MI. that asked about all the crap he’s been through, I do know Snyder past some law, to paid innocent person that in prison, so if you get a added extra sentence as to added to the registry and it’s not legal someone need to show us the money, and they added the crazy$50. fine!! I’ve talked to a attorney but he said we couldn’t get any money, at first it seem like maybe, he said… Read more »

I’d work and ensure that they paid dearly for stealing from me, even if it is only $50. My personal formula is that I need to cost them at least 12x any amounts that they cost me. So $50 would work out to $600. There are many, many ways to take money from big government and their law enforcement criminals (LECs). The best way is to own and/or control businesses that they use. If you are not able to do that, at the very least, all people who are listed on the Registries should be members of local watch groups… Read more »

Each state’s attorney general is charged with the responsibility of enforcing the laws, as well as the ability to pass new legislation. The state attorney general also has the higher purpose of protecting the people of the state and their interests. Attorney general duties include providing consumer protections from fraud, scams and dangerous products, people and situations, protection of the state’s resources by upholding state and federal environmental laws, oversight or direct involvement in criminal court cases and appeals, enforcement of judgments, such as child support and victim’s programs, and formal opinions to state and federal agencies. Most states give… Read more »

@everyone, i just listen to the betts and Snyder oral arguments. I think i am more confused then ever now. I can’t tell if it was argued in our favor or not, it seemed like they were continuing to kick the can down the street. They didn’t even bring up Ms Nessel’s briefs and that she even agrees Michigan’s SORNA is Punishment and unconstitutional. It could be i missed something, so if anyone understands what happened, can you explain it in simple terms. Thank you.

I kinda felt that way too…..I wasn’t particularly encouraged by that at all….as I have stated before, I don’t want to wait a indefinite amount of time while everybody negotiates….maybe we’ll get some big surprise ruling in our favor in the next couple of weeks but I’m not holding my breath….

Hello everyone, how do I find the link so I can watch it, thanks ?

But my question is this. If the Michigan Supreme Court rules that the registry is punishment, how will that affect those of us who were already on the list before the 2006 & 2011 changes were made? And will that ruling eliminate that $50 a year they charge us to be on the list? I think it’s stupid that we have to pay the State to be on that list. There is no way it costs the State $2 million to maintain that list every year.

Hopefully, a lot will change…a lot less information posted on line, residency restrictions, 25 year or shorter registry periods, being able to attend your kid’s school events…..etc. I would guess the $50 fee would hopefully disappear too….for several of us it would mean removal from the registry all together based on time served…

If all goes well I would come off this stupid list next summer. And it would be nice if they had to reimburse us that money they made us pay out the last four years. When I was released, it was a one time $50 fee for the FBI database I was told. Funny how they change things to suit them. And of course we’re their favorite targets.

Hope to get this over, it’s a real mess, that should have never happen

Make it matter now. Law enforcement criminals don’t make much. YOU can help keep that low. YOU can help increase their discontent and hate of their jobs. YOU can help create more turnover and chaos.

It is fun to complain and vent here, but take action in real life to make the Registries cause huge problems.

This is also interesting… A brief from ACLU filed a week before the AG’s brief.

Looks like it’s going to be the legislation to correct this mess!

If not then it’s back in U.S. district court, which Clealand has to rule SOR is “null and void” for every pre-2011 registrants for severability reasons! He has to comply with 6th court ruling which IS BINDING!

Wtf does this mean in the big picture of things? I DON’T want to wait not one second longer than is necessary. In the few email conversations that I’ve had with Ms. Aukerman and her people, they were thinking sometime this summer because these things “take time”. I’ve been on this F’n registry more than half my life and enough is enough. Anybody want to take a guess or give an opinion on what this means in light of last week’s developments?

One last point and then I’ll stop ranting. Given the apparent lack of opposition from AG Nessel, the aclu should break off negotiations and go get the partial summary judgment from judge Cleland LIKE TOMORROW! I still feel strongly that we’ll get NO help from the legislature…NONE. I still stand by the opinion that more people would benefit from summary judgement against the 06 & 11 changes…for crying out loud 2/3 of the existing registry at the time was reclassified to tier 3 and a lifetime on this shit show farce of a law…helping 35,000 people out 44,000 isn’t good… Read more »

@ Everyone, I emailed Ms Aukerman on the 13th about what all this means for us, now that Ms Nessel filed to briefs in our favor, and agreeing that Sorna is Punishment and unconstitutional, Well she actually just emailed me back just now, but as normal she really didn’t say much or what this really means for us, but thiswhat she did say to me. Hopefully some one else can read between the lines and then explain it to me. Here is her response: Bobby, This is an important development and we hope it will lead to changes in the… Read more »

I don’t know what she means by that….other then prosecutors are elected like politicians and want to appear tough on crime. That would be why the prosecutors are taking an opposing view point. I also don’t know how much weight they carry….we’ll see I guess. I think this was a polite reply with a less then vague answer…

What she maybe saying is, that the local prosecutors do not have the legal righ to argue opposite that of the State Attorney General, at least that is their argument. The AG by law may be the statute interpreter for stage and local government. Just how it came across to me. I do not know MI law.

@Bobby: No attorney worth her/his salt is going to say much in writing unless compelled to do so. That’s doubly so in discussing an open, pending case. I think her writing conveyed a bit of optimism (“important development”) and perhaps some confidence in the outcome (“see if the Court thinks that they can”). I don’t think there’s a person involved in this case who doesn’t see the box the County Prosecutor (and the Legislature) have been put in. They just can’t say so. I would love to have been a fly on the wall when the County Prosecutor learned of… Read more »

Hello Everyone

I got this in an email today and there is also another one that is exactly the same but for David Snyder’s case
So does this mean the oral arguments are postponed for March 6?. I just checked and they are both still scheduled to be heard in the afternoon of March 6thmaybe it’s just me but i’m confused so if some one could explain what this means for both case’s, are they both postponed or are they still ago for March 6th, Thanks in advance, here is the link.

David Snyder’s say’s the same thing

I don’t think it means anything other than the court is making sure that there’s a level playing field. I think they’re giving the other side a chance to respond and nothing more. I haven’t seen anything that says that the hearings are postponed either. I could be wrong and hopefully one of our better & brighter legal minds has the answer you’re looking for..

All it means is the MI SC is allowing an amicus to be filed outside the normal time frames. Perhaps they’re filing beyond 30 days, or after January 31, or whatever. It’s nothing at all to be concerned about and doesn’t affect anything beyond getting an amicus included in the case.

This is a third party Amicus brief filed from the CDAM (Criminal Defense Attorneys of Michigan) on Feb 15th. This is just more ammunition for us! They are involved with teaching constitutional laws to defense lawyers and working with legislation to change those laws that are not constitutional! The brief has not been published to the public yet!

I do believe that the MSC will “deny leave to appeal” and let legislation rewrite SORA with the help from all these third parties (ACLU, CDAM, AG, etc.).

Anyone else getting excited the closer we get to March 6 th? I’ve finally seen some light at the end of the tunnel. And I refuse to give up hope. I know that it’s unrealistic to expect some resolution at the hearing; but a girl can dream. Right?

Would love your thoughts, please comment.x