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National

6th Circuit Decision Requires Registration Even When State No Longer Does

The Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals has issued a decision, that if left unchallenged, will require some individuals convicted of a sex offense to continue to register for life even if the state in which he resides no longer does.

“This decision is shocking and could reverse the benefits of every state’s Tiered Registry laws as well as other post conviction relief,” stated ACSOL Executive Director Janice Bellucci. “The Court has literally ruled that once a sex offender, always a sex offender.”

The petitioner in this case, Mr. Willman, was convicted of a sex offense in the state of Michigan where he served 10 years in prison and then completed parole. He challenged his registration and notification duties under both Michigan state law and federal law. The federal district court ruled against Mr. Willman and therefore he appealed that court’s decision.

In its decision, the 6th Circuit ruled that all “sex offenders”, that is, anyone convicted of a sex offense, is subject to federal SORNA requirements, including registration. The Court specifically ruled that “federal SORNA obligations are independent of state-law sex offender duties.”

The decision went on to determine that the federal SORNA is not cruel and unusual punishment and therefore does not violate the 8th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution because registration is not punishment. The Court also used this rationale to determine that the ex post facto clause of the U.S. Constitution was not violated.

“The combination of this Court decision with the proposed federal regulations is a threat to all registrants and cannot be ignored,” stated Bellucci. “ACSOL and its allies will work together to identify all possible ways to challenge both the Court’s decision and the proposed regulations. In order to be successful, additional resources are required at this time.”

Donations for this purpose can be made either by using the “Donate” button on the front page of the ACSOL website or by mailing donations to ACSOL at 1215 K Street, 17th Floor, Sacramento, CA 95814.

Willman v. US Atty Gen – 6th Cir – Aug 2020

Join the discussion

  1. 290 air

    Seems like this just got Teed up to be challenged to the Supreme Court.

    • Shawn

      Absent some jurisdictional hook the federal government lacks the ability to require anyone to do anything. Roberts concurrence in kebodeaux affirms scotus has never endorsed the federal government with a general police power. There can be no commerce clause authority over purely intrastate matters that are not economic in nature and when taken in the aggregate have an effect on interstate commerce. Human beings are not a commodity

  2. Promising Stats

    Decisions issued by the Sixth Circuit were reversed by the United States Supreme Court 24 out of the 25 times that they were reviewed in the five annual terms starting in October 2008 and ending in June 2013, a higher rate of reversal than for any other federal appellate court during that time period

    • Alex

      This is horrible. I take it that if this passes, California’s hope for a tier system is now shot down? Is there anything the general public can do at this point? Phone calls, write letters, etc.

    • Ron

      Thanks for that small piece of hope. It just seems to me that the US sets a very high bar to cruel and unusual. I’m a country that kills over 1000 per year in police actions it’s hardly surprising. Maybe these judges should live 12 months as sex offenders, I wonder if they’d still consider a life sentence for (in many cases) a first offense, as just?

      • Megvagy

        If you read pages 5-7 of the decision; the net effect of not having to register in MI, is that… as long as he does not leave MI, he is “okay.” He is also “okay” if he travels outside of MI, as long as he stays ahead of the 48 hour restriction for each jurisdiction.

    • Chase

      If the sixth circuits decision’s are being reversed 96% of the time, then why has this panel not been replaced with a more law abiding one???

    • David

      @ Promising Stats: I wonder how the new makeup of SCOTUS will affect those reversal stats? 🤔 *guardedly hopeful*

    • Brandon

      I don’t see this changing the ruling here in MI. The 6th CoA determined that SORA was an unconstitutional ex post facto law because it was retroactive, and its stringent restrictions (such as severe limits on where sex offenders were allowed to live and work) constituted punishment.

      From what I can gather from reading through this, it was argued since he has no obligations for Michigan SORA that he had no obligations for federal SORNA. It was was ruled that the two are independent of each other. Excluding you from a state requirement does not exclude you from a federal requirement.

      They also ruled that because states can choose not to accept sex-offender registrations that SORNA accounts for that by providing an affirmative defense when certain criteria are met, including when “uncontrollable circumstances prevented the individual from complying and agreed with the federal government that the affirmative defense is available to Willman if Michigan does not permit him to register. After that, there is nothing else for him to do (from the perspective of SORNA) unless at least one relevant circumstance changes. If Michigan will not allow him to register then he has an affirmative defense if charged with a federal violation.

      Federal SORNA was not found to be punishment because it is far different than Michigan SORA with less restrictions and requirements.

      Federal SORNA was found not to violate ex post facto because Congress gave that power to the AG. So he can essentially retroactively apply whatever he wishes.

      The SORNA claims from what I can read was not very well litigated. I believe they even stated that a few of his claims had no arguments so they ruled against him by default.

      If MI was to rewrite SORA how it is spelled out in SORNA then there would be no claims for punishment or ex post facto as they would be following federal SORNA requirements.

      Just my two cents but these two cases are entirely different.

      • SR @ Brandon

        Wasn’t one of the punitive factors for SORA being forced to register more than once a year? And I thought SORNA forced 2x for T2 and 4x for T3? So wouldn’t at least that portion of SORNA still be punitive as ruled?

  3. Brian

    Does this mean Michigan is going to start looking for past registered offenders and make them re-register?

    • Roberta

      We are not a Sorna state. Dealing with the feds on an appeal level relies on the district you are in. The 9th does not abide by the 6th circuit and if the 6th circuit is sited in a case in district Court under the 9th..it is generally not considered.
      So, yes it can be argued but no precedent exists here. It is a horrible ruling for Michigan and the 6th. My prayer is that it doesn’t spread.

  4. PK

    This Country is just **Nuts**

  5. w

    Take that covid stimulus and donate! One less smoke a day! No cheese on that Whopper! Keep that old TV longer! Sacrifice now for a better tomorrow!

    • Tim in WI

      fACT is far too few people really contemplate the true nature of the database and the database driven infrastructure!

      Never underestimate the infrastructure’s ability to overrun traditional notions of sovereignty and jurisdiction. The Playpen case for example, in which the judge lamented about the uninformed nature and misuse of warrant that had his signature.

      Now overlay that powerful, but covert ability upon the separation of powers between federal authority and 50 individual state sovereigns regarding police powers and authority as it allows upon the citizenry. Currently the people revolt and the feds are moving into the conflict. Clearly the press compartmentalize the revolt as totally about police authority concerning the segment of the population who identify as ” black” people. The fact is all of the people suffer the indignities of a police state run amuck. Blacks and sex offenders are both minority groups, therefore historically a pattern of undue authority has existed whereby the most unstomachable human acts are perpetrated by gov agencies the 50 United States.

      Unlike the protest prone black population, sex offenders have yet to march on DC.
      And unlike those who identify as proud black person are more likely protest. Simply put, IMHO sex offenders are less likely to protest because they are not proud. The difference in popular perceptions is quite stark. What is left to check the currently over powered police state? Truly it was the police state that return slaves to their masters. It is no different with the sex offender. The new slave to unending data.machine upkeep.

      The commoditization of personal information data stored on “the peoples” database as much as public safety interests & standards. The presumption of benevolence abhorent.

      Most of my posts @ACSOL focus on the use of a database, particularly gov use with concern for the use known as S.O.R.. I tend to see sex offender regime as a human rights issue as much as a civil rights issue. The natural distinction between; that which was provided the human via the blessed creator, versus the civil rights provided by man via the social contract known as the bill of rights and the U.S. & State Constitutions. I’ve made the same claim here- eff.org – but on a less public modus.

    • Dph

      @ W;
      I hear and 2nd that W.
      Hit it on the nailed.it!

  6. Jeremy

    This decision is INSANE.

  7. G4Change

    Isn’t this the same Court that issued the Does v. Snyder decision in Michigan?????? Are they on drugs???

  8. Marty

    One of the sadder aspects of this decision is that the courts will probably try to make it apply to anyone who has already gotten off the Registry. Time for ALL anti-registry groups to unite to get this decision overturned.

  9. Bobby S.

    So how is or does this effect the current, Does v Snyder , 1 and 2? case. If it effects it at all. We are so close now especially after what Cleland said in a recent email.

  10. AnonMom

    What the actual F is happening? Everyone is out with pitchforks now, local police, the feds, the courts. I know it is a distraction tactic, but come on! This is just getting more and more insane literally by the day. Is this a way to get it to the Supreme Court for review now? I mean they have hit a point of saying so much it is not punishment by highlighting HOW it is in in fact punishment.

  11. njm

    The opening statement seems a bit misleading, “The Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals has issued a decision, that if left unchallenged, will require anyone convicted of a sex offense to continue registration for life even if the state in which he resides no longer does.”

    Say your state offense maps to a SORNA Tier 1 offense. Even if this ruling were allowed to be adopted, the registrant would still be eligible for petitioning off the registry at the end of 15 years. Not ineligible “for life” as stated above, correct? Was the intent to say that if your state gave you an offramp via Tiers, but SORNA put the offense in Tier 3, then you would not be eligible for getting off as your state had provided for?

    Any clarification would be appreciated.

    • SR

      Yes, that’s what it means. You still technically follow your own states registry laws and can be relived through it despite all this, but that relief is only available while you’re still within your state. If you move to another state that does abide by SORNA, they can just stick you back in. There’s also nothing in this new revision that would prevent them from changing SORNA tier levels down the road and recapturing people. You being T1 via SORNA today doesn’t mean in 10 years they might not make you T2 or T3 and force you to re-register. The entire problem is the 2003 ruling that made anything having to do with registration a “civil regulation”.

  12. ExpatRFSO

    This is insane. There isn’t even a way to register federally. There has been some really draconian things happening in the Federal courts lately. These judges must be the alt-right and unqualified Trump appointees. Like the guy who ran the erotic story site for 20 years suddenly arrested by the FBI on indecency charges. I wonder what judge signed that warrant. Trump is going after sex crimes in a big way to appeise the evangelicals who (ironically) came out in a big way for him in 2016 but more so to compensate for his own lengthy history of criminal sexual behavior with women and underage girls.

  13. LS

    In the mail tomorrow, I will be mailing a check for as much as I possibly can. Thank you Janice and ACSOL!

  14. JohnDoeUtah

    They know they cannot force the states to comply without violating the Tenth Amendment; but, they can make you as an individual comply or face imprisonment – as long as the state is willing to accept a SORNA requirement. Some states would have to change their laws to allow this.

    Utah uses its own length and frequency requirements for those convicted of Utah Code violations, and the convicting jurisdiction’s length and frequency requirements for “out-of-state” convictions. A simple amendment to also consider SORNA requirements would be all that is needed. However, this would significantly alter the number of people required to register in a state, including those already released by a state registry.

    What I foresee here is Michigan AG using this to further delay Does v Snyder during the next hearing. The Michigan Legislature will likely adopt a new law that hinges in-part on SORNA duties, preventing many from escaping the grasp of the Snyder decision.

    Also, while this case might be distinguished from Snyder, as it is SORNA and not Michigan SORA, is not Snyder binding precedent? I didn’t think that a panel could overturn the findings of another panel in the same circuit? Snyder made it clear that based on the empirical evidence, there was not a rational relation between the registry and public safety.

  15. Mike D

    To all readers! IMHO the best way you can act now is to DONATE!

    In regards to:
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
    Donations for this purpose can be made either by using the “Donate” button on the front page of the ACSOL website or by mailing donations to ACSOL at 1215 K Street, 17th Floor, Sacramento, CA 95814.
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++=
    DONATE RIGHT NOW! Give whatever you can afford, no gift is too small or too big! Just give and give generously. DO IT

    This is my own opinion and I do not work for or represnt ASCOL

    • Dph

      @Mike D,
      You are SO RIGHT Mike D!
      This would way worse than the last crisis [residency restrictions here] this will affect ALL, not just CA!
      Fed- $ ACSOL needs funds to travel and fight FED Court & MAY Have to go to SCOTUS(?!!?)

  16. HopingforHope

    I guess I’m a little confused. Does this mean Tier 1’s and Tier 2’s under SORNA must register for life?

    • SR

      Some things under CA tier system falls under a different SORNA tier and vice versa. For example, CP under CA’s system is T3 and life. But under SORNA it’s T1/T2 (depending on what you did). But somethings under CA’s T2 are T3 under SORNA. For now, SORNA won’t be enforced under CA’s laws and you can still de-register under CA’s tier system. But if you move someplace that does follow SORNA, you likely will have to register again, if applicable. AND if CA every adopts SORNA, it’ll likely render your previous release from registering null as this ruling says the two systems are independent and you have to keep doing whichever is greater.

    • Janice Bellucci

      @HopingForHope – This is a time of confusion. We are working hard to sort out the possibilities. Here is one example. As of now, SORNA assigns anyone convicted of possessing unlawful images (aka child pornography) to Tier 1, which requires 10 to 15 years of registration. In California the same people will be assigned under the Tiered Registry Law to Tier 3, which requires lifetime registration. In this situation, individuals in CA will be required to register for life even though SORNA would limit registration to no more than 15 years.

      • Dph

        thx so much for clarification Janice, maybe SCOTUS if it has to go that far and they’ll actually willing to hear our unfair, unConstitional and unjust continual perm (except Death-prob be like FL) regis!

  17. LES

    All of our high hopes for the new (CA) tiered registry, gone in the blink of an eye. I am so sad now. So sad.

    • Janice Bellucci

      @LES – Please don’t give up. We have opportunities to turn this decision around as well as stop the proposed regulations. Members of the ACSOL board and allies are meeting on Tuesday to discuss options and strategies some of which will be revealed on this website and others kept closer to the vest. Please be patient as we aim first, then fire.

      • LES

        Thank you Janice. My donation check goes in the mail tomorrow. I agree with Mike D, everyone even though many of us are hurting financially due to Covid, try to send whatever you can, small or large to ACSOL to fight these inequities. Many of us here in California are still able to live in our houses, apartments, condos, etc. because of Janice and her strenuous fights against presence restrictions. God Bless You Janice.

      • dph

        Goodluck Board Mbrs, enlighten them JB! GO Team GO

    • SR

      For now, this shouldn’t have any effect on the CA system. You just might not be able to move elsewhere that does follow SORNA as your relief under the CA system might not be recognized by the other states because of that.

      • JuniorSD

        Correct me if I’m wrong, but that was potentially already the case before this decision, regardless if a state is SORNA compliant or not. Being relieved from the duty to register in one state doesn’t necessarily relieve you if you move to another state. It would depend on how the new state’s registry laws are written for people moving in from out of state jurisdictions. I think most state’s laws are worded to require registration if you are required to register in your original state, but I believe there are some that will require registration if you’ve committed an offense that qualifies in that state, regardless of your duty to register in the original state.

        • SR

          You’re correct. This would make it more common though as most states generally adhere to other state court rulings, making it so it’s less likely you’ll need to start registering again when moving if you’ve already been removed from your original state. But because this is federal, the state has no say if they follow SORNA. And it’s made worse by the current 6th ruling since they make a distinction that federal and state guidelines are completely independent.

  18. john

    wow so if i understand this right, they are going to try to put the people that got off back on also?

  19. James I

    Let me note that this greatly distressing news.

    The only defense to being beaten on the head as we repeated are…is to live a good life, or as good as possible, be happy, respect yourself and do what you do as well as you can.

    My check is also in the mail.

    Finally, I will add that eventually a political route will have to be taken…I looked up the number of RSO’s in San Diego County to see if maybe something could be done against Ms. Lorena Fletcher and her upcoming election in the 80th Assembly District….and the number for the entire county was only 1,017…or at least that’s the number I got back…and in her district the number of RSO voters would be far less….and so an election push by me…seemed fruitless.

    But as happened in Coalinga and changing the election results….we have to start targeting this kind of stuff…up and down each and every ballot for each and every position.

    I find it impossible to believe that 100,000 of us in California, if properly banded together, could not influence elections….and nationally, we are close to 1 million votes…if, our consciousness in these regards was raised.

    Good Luck to Everyone….James I

  20. ReadyToFight

    I think I’d like to get off the Registry and leave this country to the politicians at this point. They can have it if they want it so bad.

  21. Jack7170

    Hmm. I might be being overly optimistic here, but here’s my question. Based on this quote “Further, we agree with the federal government that the affirmative defense is available to Willman if Michigan does not permit him to register. ” Why would a state permit somebody to register, if the state law doesn’t require them to? Same thing applies to Mr. Barr’s proposed rule making.

  22. Philip Wilson

    33 years ago. Ten years probation. Off 2001 NON ADJUDICATED. I 44 years on the railroad retired regression for life??? Texas Oh yeah only one arrest. One charge.

    • M C

      @Jack7170, simple absent a state law that explicitly prohibits it, a law need not exist that allows it. To put it simply, the executive branch is tasked with this purpose and anyone with the willingness to register you from a police officer to the governor of your state could simply say no problem if you walked into their office and they go ahead and do it without any such legislative requirement. The only caveat being if there is no funding available for the particular executive branch office to do so.

      • Jack7170

        @MC Or a constitutional ruling then of course. Meaning in Michigan, since they’re literally not allowed to register anybody pre 2011.

  23. TnT

    These Clowns just keep stepping all over each others coat tails , This is so crazy to think we were so close here in Michigan , This is such major highs and very dark and deep lows. Its so hard to believe I’ve been able to endure this crazy life for the last 28 years , It can be so tuff sometime not to loose it . They are going to keep this shit up until people just start snapping. Such a joke how they keep going around each others backs and with sneaky rules, dirty tricks, and how they drag it on and on until they WIN . Sad but true , How and the HELL can they not believe this B.S is not punitive and can be retroactive LIFE sentences. Its so unjust .

  24. New Person

    This is depressing news.

    This is bad law like the 3/5th compromise, Jim Crow laws, and Japanese Internment camps. Using the logic of “as long as we say the purpose is civil, then it will always be civil unless you can prove it 100% it is not civil” is cult like as it has no room for review nor introspection as the threshold is far too high.

    Here, I was thinking that with my next annual registration that it could be my last time ever registering. Yet this news is trying to take away my ability to become normal again. I may just try to sue CA myself for denying my ability to pursue and obtain privacy as per the CA Constitution to show that privacy is a lost right and, thus, is punishment under CA Constitution. I don’t know where to begin, but it’s either I do this to make believe I have something to live for or just give up altogether because I’m irredeemable by the state and nation.

    Anyhow, I just donated to the cause.

    All I can do is pray.

    • dph

      stay afloat and staying positive NEW PERSON, and thanks for the donation. to ACSOL, very kind and helpful I andnithers will too! Chin up, all may not be list, read Janice’s response midway back up comments above hour’s new person.

  25. Worried in Wisconsin

    If I understand correctly, the only avenue for the Feds to have jurisdiction at all is because they have deemed crossing the state lines to be “interstate commerce”.

    Perhaps the way to attack this, as well as many other Federal over-reaches, is to finally put an end to classifying crossing a state border the same as interstate commerce. If that one piece falls, then the Feds lose jurisdiction over a whole bunch of things.

    Of course, if one is truly involved in interstate commerce this wouldn’t help, but how in the world is simply crossing from one state to another commerce?

    • Bo

      It is not. But it is so much more complicated than that. Without going too deep, in 52 districts there have been decisions saying it is interstate commerce and using a mix of the 3 factors in Lopez, to justify their decisions with 4 districts saying it’s not. 2 of which actually seprated out the registration requirement from the punishment. Also the districts are mixed on what “travels” means. As in the future after the act was passed, the gap years in between, or at any time, unrelated to the registration failures. I joked with my wife earlier today, “It bottles the mind” (Anchor Man)

  26. Brandon

    Nothing surprises me anymore when it comes to our government. How many times can they keep knocking people down and not call it cruel and unusual punishment? I thought COVID and riots would shake things up; yet it’s gotten worse for human and civil rights. What’s next concentration camps with gas chambers? I feel for those that have put on the uniform to defend this country and are now treated like an enemy of the state. Time to turn in my club membership and give this country what it deserves nothing. This country is pure evil and I’ve never been so ashamed of America or society as I am now.

  27. Jordan Devaney

    I though Judge Cleland in Michigan ruled the law violate ex post facto?

    • fuzzy

      @Jordan Devaney

      Cleland is a U.S. District Court judge which is different from the 6th Circuit Court of Appeals. I wish these judges would just get on the same page.

      • Bobby S.

        @Fuzzy, but the 6th Circuit already ruled Does v Snyder was punishment and unconstitutional including the ex POS facto, and SCOTUS agreed by denying cert. So right now, the 6th in my opinion is contradicting itself, unless I’m missing something. Cleland is already getting tired of the Michigan Legislature, and has ordered meeting between the legislature and the ACLU very soon. I think he should order all pre-sorna 2006 and 2011 registrants off the registry now.

        • fuzzy

          Bobby, if I’m not mistaken Cleland is a District Court judge. I’m not trying to be doom and gloom by any means. Mainly just trying to make sense of all of this.

    • G4Change

      If I’m not mistaken, I think initially Cleland ruled that the Michigan registry was NOT a violation of ex post facto. His ruling was then appealed to the 6th Circuit CoA which then DID rule that it was ex post facto!
      Now this court rules the way it did the other day. I mean, they gotta be doing drugs on that bench! This is effing lunacy!!!

      • M C

        @G4Change, it may seem like lunacy when you look at these rulings along with registration as a whole but if you look at the actual issue before the 6th it’s actually somewhat logical though I may not agree with them. One of the cases was an ex post facto question involving certain things in Michigans registry scheme which were punitive even when looking at it under the Smith v Doe decision. The more recent decision really involves the concept of registration under SORNA which is generally considered to be non punitive under the Smith v Doe. As such the question really involves whether not this non punitive federal requirement is independent from that of the state requirements. As such the two cases have little to do with each other as they answer totally different questions of law.

        • G4Change

          @ M C

          Interesting! Based on your explanation, I have to agree with you. And, like you, I also do not agree with their recent decision. I think registration alone is punishment, but I digress and I know I’m preaching to the choir.
          So, at best, the folks in Michigan will probably have to continue to endure registration but at least are relieved of the onerous restrictions.

        • JohnDoeUtah

          @MC

          I actually disagree with you here. The circuit clearly attempted to overrule prior precedent in Does v. Snyder.

          I’ll point you to an August 5, 2020, preliminary injunction out of Tennessee, in Reid v. Lee, Case No. 3:20-cv-00050 (M.D. Tenn. Aug. 5, 2020).

          The State of Tennessee attempted to argue that it had already been decided in 1999 and 2007, that the Tennessee Registry was not unconstitutional. However, the court stated that while those cases were correct at the given time, Snyder present new evidence which changes the calculus (specifically the efficacy of the registry and the rebuttal of “frightening and high”). The Court went on to state that it would not appear that the analysis in the current Tennessee case would be different than in Snyder, unless the State has new rebuttal evidence; but, that Snyder was enough to grant a preliminary injunction.

          If Snyder is binding precedent for the purposes of Reid v. Lee, Case No. 3:20-cv-00050 (M.D. Tenn. Aug. 5, 2020); Doe v. Rausch, 382 F. Supp. 3d 783, 788 (E.D. Tenn. 2019); and, Doe v. Gwyn, No. 3:17-CV-504, 2018 WL 1957788 (E.D. Tenn. Apr. 25, 2018), then there is no reason it cannot apply as binding precedent to federal SORNA.

        • M C

          @JohnDoeUtah, you might be right. I will look more into the cases you cite. I was trying to convey that that Does v Snyder and this one are mainly deciding different things and so I wouldn’t read too much into this being inconsistent with Does v Snyder. Yes ex post facto was considered somewhat here but it wasn’t the main thing being decided.

        • Brandon L

          I would agree that Does v Snyder could and should be used as binding precedent for state SORAs. The issue that l see in Snyder is that it was ruled SORA’s restrictions are far more onerous than those considered in Smith. Is the federal SORNA more onerous than what was considered in Smith?

          Snyder does bring into light the misrepresentation of the recidivism rates that was in the Smith v Doe ruling. In order for federal SORNA to be punitive Smith has to be overturned.

  28. fuzzy

    The problem is that as long as judges keep saying “it’s not punishment”, the legislature can keep changing the rules and moving the goal posts as much as they want. Not sure what this means for us in Michigan who thought we might be getting some relief. I fall under pre 2011 and have no clue what is going on in the 6th Circuit right now and how that impacts Judge Cleland’s decision in District court. This is turning into more and more of a cluster every day. Now the feds are trying to pull a fast one too. The registry doesn’t work, it IS punishment. Why else would they plead these cases out to probation or short jail/prison terms and then say “we still got him, he’s on the registry for xx years”? Just f’ing ridiculous what’s going on right now.

    • Jordan Miles Devaney

      Ya I’m CSC 4th which by Michigan law as low risk, but I’m tier 3 which is high risk and I have no tether. So Michigan is saying I’m a low risk but a high risk.

      These people are just stupid. I even having proof that I did nothing. I passed the lie detector, but courts believe mothers over men.

  29. someone who cares

    This just seems like something out of a horror movie. How can they always apply more and different rules and laws any time they please? Once this is fought, another “law” will pop up. And what about the notifying the registration office if you leave for more than 7 days? What kind of BS is that? People go on vacation. It IS punishment every way you look at it. What is not to understand?

    • David

      Agreed. How Is it not punishment when every slightest f****** failure to do a thing can end you up in prison for years??
      How is that not punishment??
      How are their residential compliance checks and extensive paperwork requirements not continued correctional supervision (i.e., punishment!!!!)???
      😠😠😠😠😠😠😠

  30. AERO1

    The US government has raped murdered and tortured innocent men women and children for hundreds of years so don’t be surprised or discouraged when they continue to tighten their grip on sexofenders Federal Government SORNA can force individual Californians to abide by the their federal laws but that won’t stop the state of California’s new tier law from going into effect and anyone who qualifies to be relieved of there duty to register will be.
    If the FBI wants to in force SORNA laws they will have to do so at their own expense they’ll have do there own compliance checks its kinda like when the medical marijuana laws were pass it was legal to sale marijuana in California but the FBI still kept raiding and closing down shops and arresting shop owners and charging them on a federal level.
    The state of California is over this madness their washing there hands of this life time registration BS and the FBI knows it but on their way out to cover their ass California is gonna make shore anyone who has cases involving children will never be free and will be handed over to the FBI on a silver platter.
    The sexofender community is growing rapidly and the us government knows this so to pervert any type up protest or uprising their gonna do whatever it takes to first divide them up then concur and SVP’s and child molesters are top on their hit list.
    It’s so obvious who theses laws are being tailor made to fit

    Good luck

  31. TnT

    Not sure what it will do for the Michigan ruling ?? Would think that the Cleland Ruling was before this but who knows lol Its so crazy that all these judges keep choosing sides instead of doing what is right and constitutional . How can they say its punishment then Opps i mean its not … Crazy . Everyone knows the registry is punitive and punishment 100% . Any one on it should get disability, because it disables those who are on it .

  32. Jordan Devaney

    The government would probably be content in giving everyone on the list the death penalty no matter the severity of the crime. Talk about stereotyping. I thought stereotyping was wrong to do.

    Not everyone on the list is a hard core rapist like the government thinks.

  33. Ditto

    Seems to be a conflict with the proposed SORNA regulations. Note the “Federal jurisdiction.” Or maybe the DOJ already knew of this 6th Cir. decision and anticipated broad jurisdiction to enforce registration by claiming to have jurisdiction over the entire U.S.

    “SORNA has a dual character, imposing registration obligations on sex offenders as a matter of Federal law that are federally enforceable under circumstances supporting Federal jurisdiction, see 18 U.S.C. 2250, and providing minimum national standards that non-Federal jurisdictions are expected to incorporate in their sex offender registration and notification programs, subject to a reduction of Federal funding for those that fail to do so, see 34 U.S.C. 20912(a), 20926-27.”

    https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2020/08/13/2020-15804/registration-requirements-under-the-sex-offender-registration-and-notification-act

    However, if the supremacy clause trumps state regulations, then SORNA should have trumped state regulations from the git-go with its tiers and sometimes less restrictive “regulatory” requirements. Maybe lawyers will weigh in.

    https://www.huffpost.com/entry/state-vs-federal-law-who-_b_4676579

  34. Confused Man

    If I’m not mistaken, Does v Snyder held that tiers are ex post facto in Michigan. SORNA has tiers. Ergo, SORNA violates ex post facto for the same class of registrants. Seems open and shut to me.

  35. Facts should matter

    You can’t tweak something that never worked to begin with, but that won’t stop the authorities from garnering ill-earned pride from enforcing it.

    SORNA is retaliatory vengeance, not justice. The irony is, at the end of the day, Adam Walsh still dies in vain, despite the lawmaker’s callously touted claim that it would “honor” his memory.

  36. Chris F

    I don’t understand how this keeps getting ruled as not punishment given the unfettered expansion of negative impacts to liberty since Smith V Doe. No way can it pass the mendoza test.

    Are lawyers not including the latest international travel restrictions and passport marking as well as federal housing assistance denial and eeop declaration that it is ok to use sex offender lists to deny jobs even though any other crime you let slide after 7 years?

    These are all Federal disabilities to registered people that occur because states put people on the registry and supply the government with that list. Therefore, all that counts toward what the state putting someone on the registry does. The state cannot claim those disabilities cant be brought up because they are out of their control. The state is in control by providing the list and not having proper procedural and substantive due process protections to keep people off the list that don’t deserve the federal disabilities.

  37. Deborah

    Janice, as far is just hitting the donation button, it would help me so much more to know exactly how much Each registrant needs to come up with. I know each will not be able to come up with that amount of money, or even close, and absolutely no judgment there, but putting a “face” on the amount would surely help our organization know What we are looking at before it gets to the higher levels such as the AG etc. This is not a political comment in the least. I would like to hit this at the lower level before it gets that far. I have contacted you previously and I’m still willing to do anything I could possibly do to help. This is such abuse. Thank you for all you do Janice

    • SR

      There are 100k us in CA. If we all gave $10, that would be $1 million for the cause.

      • David

        Okay, I’m sending an extra check (in addition to my ongoing monthly contribution).💲👍

  38. john

    more I think about this I am wondering, if I am in a non sorna state. In Minnesota atm, Just me leaving the country seems it would make it federal and IML will be triggered for going overseas, which may re-trigger registration?

    • M C

      @john, it wouldn’t re-trigger registration. I know currently MN won’t register someone who wants to register under SORNA if they aren’t required to do so under the states laws. This didn’t mean they won’t do so in the future especially if the new proposed federal rules are adopted however.

      • john

        awesome thanks, thats what I am worried about these new laws. feel like I am in a race against time, waiting on a passport that will proboly take twice as long bc of my conviction lol. bright side save more money not a chance I’m coming back here

        • M C

          Passport won’t take longer for that reason. Probably won’t come stamped if conviction against minor unless it was already revoked for that reason. Your passport might be revoked if you don’t have a stamp upon return to USA or if you don’t return may be revoked while overseas and you may have to go to an embassy to get a stamped one.

  39. John

    yep should be here in a few months just a bad joke, so tired of this, been blessed thru it with the right people around but dam. hoping it don’t come stamped, that would keep me from trying the Philippines, but plan to just get a sail boat if it stamped, never had a passport. I was hoping that would affect it but that is just wishful thinking lol.

    • john

      update on the passport, I just got it today it took 6 weeks instead of the 6 months they told me. it did say check pg 27 for endorsements, but the page doesn’t have the mark. decided to drive down to Mexico and try to get in thru there. not trying to get in there, just want to see if USA will revoke it before I do leave so it don’t happen when I go

  40. CA cool RC

    I hope “Price Club” wasn’t brought up again

  41. A.D.A.T.

    With my current “windfall” from the state EDD. I have set up a monthly $20 donation. I encourage those that have the ability to follow me in getting ACSOL and NARSOL the funds they need to continue the fight to maintain our rights as citizens. The judicial and political system continues to position registrants in such a way as to relegate us to the trash heap of humanity. The face on their dart boards. We need to supply those willing to go to war for us the funds with which to fight with. Money talks, and we all have experienced this. Time has come to make your taxes and hard work be heard. If not now, then when.

    • David

      Agree! I will send extra funds today (in addition to my monthly regular monthly donation).

  42. From MI

    Everyone,

    In addition to donating money, everyone can submit comments to the below link. Below the link is what the ACLU from MI had sent out today. Now is the time for everyone to allow their voices to be heard.

    https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2020/08/13/2020-15804/registration-requirements-under-the-sex-offender-registration-and-notification-act

    The link above is a better way to submit your comments on the proposed Rule Changes to SOR being offered up by the United State office of the Attorney General. At this point as I send this out thier is only about 200+ comments from across the United States. I am saddened by the fact that this number is not 1,000. You only have limited time to submit comments. Many of you asked me if it does any good to submit comments. I can only say if you do nothing then the rules will go into place without any opposition. You can talk about so many points including that the Smith V Alaska case is way off point the Recidivism rate as shown even by the FBI is NOT frighteningly high, you can talk about using the many studies to show what should be done with Registries, not scare tactics, you can talk about the fact that studies have shown that the Registry is not cutting down on sexual assaults and in fact may be raising crime rates, you can talk about the harm it does to families, you can talk about the fact the some family members do not report that they have been sexually assaulted because they do not want a family member on the Registry, talk about most sex crimes are committed by a person well known to the victim, you can talk about how even if a person who is on the registry and they are doing good and complete all terms of the court and no other convictions they is no path off the registry, you can talk about that even people with no conviction are on Sex Offender Registry, you can talk about that a lifetime on the registry is serving no useful purpose after 10 years and studies back that up. You can talk about placing people on the Registry for any number of years without a Risk Assessment for thier chance of recidivism is not a valid way to place people on the Registry, and what about the money and lost Law Enforcement time spent on this program with little return value, and about the fact that this money used on the registry could be used for victim treatment and public education. And finally, you can ask why is the Department of Justice promoting a Registry that is only used by those elected to office to use as a way to get reelected by saying they are going to make the sex offender Registry even more strict, giving the elected official a chance for some news coverage at no cost to the elected official. I have given you so many talking points and you I am sure have more please think about it we need more people to comment. When they first talked about the rules for the Adam Walsh act very few comments were submitted and you now see what we have, so speak up with your comments do NOT wait for the other guy to do it. We can only try to stop this or at least have them rethink the position they have taken if everyone submits comments.

    • M C

      I’ve made my comments I’m not sure that comments about the registry law itself is within the scope of the proposed changes as that is legislative I think the comments should be related to changes that would be within the powers delegated to the AG such as the retroactive part. For example, suggesting that retroactive application not apply to anyone even those it has already been applied to.

      • TS

        @M C is on to something. I would like to see here a formatted set of cohesive bullet points applicable to the proposed text here so the comments can be viewed with an eye of seriousness and not just rambling. Use them much like is done with online petitions where you can then add your own text.

        Whether the comments are viewed or not is irrelevant because you need to speak out since you have the ability to do so. The AG will do whatever they please but speaking out intelligently is best. IF the AG always goes back to the one person who did something while the rest did not, THEN that needs to be discussed also using Blackstone’s commentaries about 1 guilty person vs many innocent people (you can research that). Blanket statements are not what this country is about.

        • w

          Blanket statements are effective when using the all-powerful “Sex Offender” phrase. It’s just a no-win game, a one-way avenue for lot’s of bad laws and little to no progress.

    • Bobby S.

      @from MI,. So we’re exactly do you leave a comment?, not that it will do any good, because it won’t , THEY could careless on what we have to say, I bet they just laugh and delete it. I’ve been in this damn thing for 28 years now, and ever since we won, I’ve been waiting to be removed from the registry like many others. I know many will disagree with me, but sending in how we feel and how it effects us or our families, is not going to change the Governments mind they are making to much money off of us, and laughing all the way to the bank. I just hope Judge Cleland finally has enough of the Legislatures nonsense and finally voices a final judgement and starts the clock.

      • Sheldon

        Thesse people could careless about us and they never will thats why we are still on the registry. I think they are going to raise the annual registry fee and also keep passing laws against us. Just my opinion.

      • AL

        @Bobby S. you’ve said that you have been on the registry for 28yrs and waiting to get off, I’ve been on it for 19yrs this year and had my conviction set aside in 2012 and still waiting to get off the registry. I’ve had 8 yrs on it with no charge. I also live in the not so great state of Michigan

        • Bobby S.

          @AL, Yes back in 1992 when I was 23, for a she said he said thing, and as you are aware it was before a registry ever existed. So yes I’ve been waiting for a while now, I’m now 51 , just wish Cleland would say enough is enough already and start the clock.

  43. Dr.

    So mad 😡 I can’t think straight!
    If joe Biden wants 44,000 + votes In Michigan maybe someone smarter and more eloquent than Myself should email him at least to get his opinion?
    Otherwise I and a few others will just crawl back under the rocks until the sweet release of death.

  44. Disgusted in Michigan

    With the Court order still in place stating the Michigan SORA cannot be enforced by the State Police, and me not having verified since December 2019, I am wondering if anyone else has noticed how many RSOs in Michigan have been out abducting, molesting, and raping children. I sure am glad the registry has been keeping the public safe for the past several months. All these dangerous registrants sure are out of control. Look how many sex crimes have been committed by us since we were told we don’t have to verify until the emergency order ends and the State Police notify us of what we have to do going forward. Yeah, I’m being sarcastic of course, but those in control of the registry should take into consideration that ZERO sex crimes have been committed by RSOs during this time. This should make it obvious that registries do absolutely NOTHING to prevent sex crimes by those on it. I’m also loving the fact that the Michigan Legislature currently has a bill drafted asking for several million dollars to be taken from the SORA budget and put into the general fund to balance the budget. I say take it all, not just the $3 million or whatever it is they’re asking for.
    Just my opinion.

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